Direct drive Bondtech lgx vs Dyze Extruder Pro

Hi everybody,

My printer is a fusion3 f410 is a big build volume woth high speed travel around 350mm/s using a volcano hotend and bowden setup for the speed

Seems like I never really print fast as my main materials are abs, pc and nylon and print doesnt looks as good over 70mm/s

Recently upgraded the printer with insulated heated chamber, watercooled steppers and hotend

Now I’m wondering whatcI should do next to improve the print quality and speed, I see 3 options:

-I could move the extruder on top facing down and shorten the bowden tube a lot

-Or I could go direct drive with either the bondtech lgx ou the dyzeextruder pro

Or a bit of both and put a bondtech/dyze on top with shorter bowden tube

Not sure how the added direct drive weight will affect the travel moves, seems like a have more inconsistent retractions extrusions than ringing

Bondtech is lighter a little bit 287g vs 300 but the dyzeextruder have watercooling adapters for my heated chamber

What would you do? Any other options to consider?

Thank you!

personally I would do direct drive, retractions are much quicker and much less sloppy.

A bit late to the party, but personally I’d start with swapping the extruder for something newer and going from there. The F410 gantry was designed for a bowden style carriage, and is prone to racking under heavier loads, so a direct drive extruder may solve some issues, but cause other new ones. You’d also have to re-design the entire X-axis carriage as there isn’t an easy way to adapt an extruder, and Fusion3 still hasn’t released their files for it.

The stock extruder is based on the classic Wade’s style extruder, which is still a decent extruder, but any recent extruder, be it a Bondtech or other would be a noticeable upgrade over what you have currently. The good news is, as the F410 uses a Duet 2 controller, swapping out the extruder for say a Bondtech BMG is pretty easy, you should be able to use the existing mounts on the chassis, and just need to update your eSteps for the extruder. I’d add in some capricorn tubing and go from there. If you’re wanting to go the direct drive route, I’d look at the FYSETEC Orbitor extruder, it’s currently one of the smallest extruders on the market, and based off an open source design (the CAD files are on Thingiverse and GitHub) so integrating that would be fairly simple, and result in a much smaller toolhead over other options.

Hi @MiniMadRyan

Welcome to the forum, I agree about the orbit, Been using it on a couple of machines, pretty simple and easy to setup, Have to be careful with the VREF cause it runs HOT. Burnt out a motor already. Very light and accurate with no slipping. Pretty impressive.

Jason

Agreed, lovely extruders for how compact they are, but can be a bit of a balancing act to find the right VREF without it getting too hot. Should also mention that Bondtech has their own take on an orbiter sized extruder coming this month, and I’m sure that will be just as good too. Just have to wait on actual stock!

Thank for your input ! I did a lot of mod on my fusion (insulation, watercooling, heated chamber etc) and my next one is a Dome on top of the printer so I can mount the extruder over in the center of the print area and shorten the bowden by half. So de boundtech will be even better with that shorter tube. Also, I was thinking I might have different setup, as exemple

-HTN CF/PEEK/PEKK etc in bowden mode with heated chamber
-Everything I want to print fast in bowden
-TPE/TPU going slower speed in direct drive by moving the extruder on the carriage with adapters. I will have the room for it with the dome

My only concern is choosing the right extruder in case I need direct drive and heated chamber together, the Dyze Desing is ready for watercooling but $$$

Trying to reduce the weight of the carriage as well, I’m considering to move the layer cooling fan on the wall of the printer and use as soft high temp silicone tube with duct on the hottend along with my watercooling and bowden tube, this way a get rid of the fan and use a bigger one as well